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 Replicate 30-30 ballistics with light 308 loads
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vpsalin
Starting Member

7 Posts

Posted - Jul 25 2016 :  22:19:16  Show Profile Send vpsalin a Private Message  Reply with Quote
How does one go about replicating 30-30 ballistics for light/cheap 308 win loads? I'm only interested in 150GR bullet loads for the time being.

WonderMan4
Advanced Member

USA
2849 Posts

Posted - Jul 25 2016 :  22:23:50  Show Profile Send WonderMan4 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
http://www.hodgdon.com/PDF/H4895%20Reduced%20Rifle%20Loads.pdf
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vpsalin
Starting Member

7 Posts

Posted - Jul 25 2016 :  22:39:06  Show Profile Send vpsalin a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Thanks, that a good start, but does someone have a more specific starting point to achieve roughly 2300fps with 150GR?
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WonderMan4
Advanced Member

USA
2849 Posts

Posted - Jul 26 2016 :  01:59:40  Show Profile Send WonderMan4 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
All I could do is guess and I would rather not.

If you go to the link, at the bottom of the page is a phone number.

The guys are nice and mostly always helpful.

Otherwise, possibly someone here on the forum might run the load thru Quick Load and get you in the ballpark.

BUT, they would need to know the bullet specifics, the case, primer.

Edited by - WonderMan4 on Jul 26 2016 02:00:39
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Shastaboat
Advanced Member



USA
9124 Posts

Posted - Jul 26 2016 :  08:39:24  Show Profile Send Shastaboat a Private Message  Reply with Quote
40 gr of 4895 and a 150 gr bullet should get you down to 2400 fps. (Lyman #45) That is max for a 30-30. You can follow Wonderman's link above if you wish to go down further. A max load is 45 gr of 4895 so 60% of 45 is 27 gr so you can go as low as that.
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ethmoid1999
Advanced Member



USA
4398 Posts

Posted - Jul 26 2016 :  09:20:05  Show Profile Send ethmoid1999 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Should be very easy with a cast bullet. No data in my books with jacketed bullets lower than just reduced loads. If for hunting, loads slower than the reduced might be better with a round nosed 30-30 bullet. Expansion at much distance might be iffy as velocity decreases with most spitzer bullets.
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Kosh75287
Advanced Member



USA
796 Posts

Posted - Jul 26 2016 :  13:17:29  Show Profile Send Kosh75287 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I tried this not long ago, for a friend who was shooting Texas whitetail with a .308. The standard velocity 150 gr. Projectiles zipped through the smaller deer without expanding much if at all. I tried, by interpolation of data for the .307 Winchester, for a load that would launch a 150 gr. Jacketed flat-point at 2350 f/s from the muzzle. The best load we found (fired from a Steyr Scout, so all relevant disclaimers should apply) was 38.3/AA-2460/150 Sierra Jacketed Flat-point, using Winchester cases. I also tried 47.0/H414/150 Sierra JFP. I don't see a notation for Cartridge OverAll Length, which tells me that I seated the projectile so that its crimping groove was at the case mouth. No actual crimp was used.

Judging from their drop at 100 Yards, we concluded that their muzzle velocities were in the 2350 - 2400 f/s range, but probably closer to 2400 f/s. The load using AA-2460 shot 3 of 5 rounds into a group just under an inch in diameter. All 5 rounds went into a circle just over 1.25". The load using H414 (also known as Winchester 760) shot 3 of 5 rounds into 1.1" and all 5 rounds into less than 1.5"

God bless Jeff Cooper

Carpe SCOTCH!
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Paul B
Advanced Member

3969 Posts

Posted - Jul 26 2016 :  15:13:44  Show Profile Send Paul B a Private Message  Reply with Quote
A few years back when my wife would occasionally actually shoot with me, I worked up a load with a 150 gr. Winchester power Point and 25.0 gr. of H4895. It was seasonally accurate in her Ruger M77 RSI and didn't kick the snot out of her. Not even sure it was a proper charge weigh, being as light as it was but it's been fine in three .308 caliber rifles.
It's normally the charge I use with a 175 gr. cast bullet which has shot 1.5 MOA at 200 yards from a Winchester M70 Youth Ranger I restocked. Velocity with cast was around 1700 FPS and I'd estimate maybe as high as 1850 with the Power Points. Never could get those bullets to shoot decent groups anywhere near full power loadings but they worked for plinking.
Another point using 30-30 level bullets in a .308 or 30-06. Loaded to around 2400 FPS they worked very well in tight cover where shots ranged from mere feet to 25 to 30 yards tops. I use to load the 170 gr. Speer 30-30 bullet for the 30-06 to an estimated 2450 FPS back in the late 1950's when I hunted the rain forests of Northwest California. Probably 90+ percent of hits were DRT. If a deer ran more than 25 yards odds were you'd never find it. The 150 gr. bullets were too destructive on good eating meat. The 170s were not quite so bad. Better to lose the shoulder than the whole animal.
Paul B.
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K22
Senior Member

442 Posts

Posted - Jul 26 2016 :  20:17:04  Show Profile Send K22 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
As another poster said, 4895 is the way to go for reduced loads in the 308.

If you going to use reduced loads for hunting make sure you use a bullet designed to shoot at 30-30 level velocity so the bullet will expand.

I have shot 40 gains of IMR 4895 with 150 Sierra Pro Hunter Spitzer for target shoots at the club. This load is very mild in recoil and shoots in the 1/2 moa range but as I mentioned, don't use this bullet for deer hunting, use a bullet designed for use in the 30-30, i.e. 150 grain Flat Nose.
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Zero333
Advanced Member



Canada
811 Posts

Posted - Jul 26 2016 :  20:45:51  Show Profile Send Zero333 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
What bullet do you wanna use??? also what's the barrel length ?

I can run some numbers in Quickload

I recommend the 160gr Hornady FTX (30395),
H-4895, 24"bbl, 2.750"coal
36gr = 2,316 fps +/-
37gr = 2,376 fps +/-


Treat that trigger like itís your first date, not like youíve been married to it for 20 years.
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Onondaga
Advanced Member



USA
4017 Posts

Posted - Jul 26 2016 :  23:10:12  Show Profile Send Onondaga a Private Message  Reply with Quote
vpsalin

Consider cast bullets

If you cast or or interested in starting to cast bullets, 30 cal is an easy start in cast.

I hunt Deer with a 30-30 load level cast bullet load in 7.62X39 My hunting load is 2010 fps with H4895 for a cast bullet in #2 alloy, the bullet is a 165 gr FNGC. My 24" barrel single shot Remington Spartan 7.62X39 groups 10 shots 1.2" at 100 yards with this cast hunting load.

My grandson hunts with a Savage 11/111 in .308 with a 170 gr FNGC at 2350 fps!!!! It groups the same as my Spartan. He has taken 2 deer that dropped very fast with vital hits at 110 and 90 yards. He is young, they were his first. One was a both jelly lung hit, the other had an exploded heart hit. Both had compete pass through and 1" bleeding exit wounds. There were bone fragments he cut himself on dressing both deer.That freaks kids out, he is learning.

We use H4895

Gary

Fine rifles are never really owned.
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vpsalin
Starting Member

7 Posts

Posted - Jul 27 2016 :  08:04:25  Show Profile Send vpsalin a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Zero333

What bullet do you wanna use??? also what's the barrel length ?

I can run some numbers in Quickload

I recommend the 160gr Hornady FTX (30395),
H-4895, 24"bbl, 2.750"coal
36gr = 2,316 fps +/-
37gr = 2,376 fps +/-



Thanks, I was thinking of finishing up some 150GR Interlocks I have and a little H4895 leftover.

I have a 20'' barrel. I was thinking 37.5GR powder...

Looks like Federal has marketed this same idea with a 170GR flat nose bullet...

Edited by - vpsalin on Jul 27 2016 08:18:07
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Shastaboat
Advanced Member



USA
9124 Posts

Posted - Jul 27 2016 :  09:08:09  Show Profile Send Shastaboat a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I'm going to bet that you will need almost 40 gr. of powder in your 20" barrel to get you 2300 fps with a 150 gr flat nose bullet designed for the 30-30. Load up a few at 37.5 and ladder up with .5 gr increments until you get to your desired velocity.
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budlight
Advanced Member



USA
1658 Posts

Posted - Jul 27 2016 :  10:24:52  Show Profile Send budlight a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Have you ever considered adding a muzzle brake? If you could attain a 45% reduction in recoil from a high powered round that would be less recoil than a reduced vel. load
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Zero333
Advanced Member



Canada
811 Posts

Posted - Jul 29 2016 :  02:30:52  Show Profile Send Zero333 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Quickload estimates...

308win.
20" bbl.
2.750" coal.
H-4895

37.5gr.
Hornady 150gr BTSP - 2,288 fps
Hornady 150gr SP - 2,296 fps
Hornady 150gr SST - 2,337 fps

38.5gr.
Hornady 150gr BTSP - 2,347 fps
Hornady 150gr SP - 2,355 fps
Hornady 150gr SST - 2,398 fps

Treat that trigger like itís your first date, not like youíve been married to it for 20 years.
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vpsalin
Starting Member

7 Posts

Posted - Jul 29 2016 :  19:10:31  Show Profile Send vpsalin a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Zero333

Quickload estimates...

308win.
20" bbl.
2.750" coal.
H-4895

37.5gr.
Hornady 150gr BTSP - 2,288 fps
Hornady 150gr SP - 2,296 fps
Hornady 150gr SST - 2,337 fps

38.5gr.
Hornady 150gr BTSP - 2,347 fps
Hornady 150gr SP - 2,355 fps
Hornady 150gr SST - 2,398 fps



Thanks a bunch, is this app available for free?
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