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 Converting 9.3x62 to 8 mm Mauser
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manobras
New Member



10 Posts

Posted - Oct 17 2016 :  05:42:44  Show Profile Send manobras a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hello,

I'm new to reloading. Please excuse my dumb questions.

I've read a lot regarding case conversions using 30-06 cases and I've successfully converted some 30-06 cases to 8 mm Mauser.

As far as I know it's also possible to convert 30-06 to 9.3x62, but what I really would like to do is to convert a bunch of 9.3x62 to 8 mm Mauser.

Is this possible? Is the process similar to the 30-06 to 8 mm conversion? Just run the empty 9.3x62 case through the 8 mm Mauser die and trim the excess?


Thank you in advance.

Kind regards,
MD


Kind regards,
MD

ligonierbill
Senior Member

USA
202 Posts

Posted - Oct 17 2016 :  06:38:12  Show Profile Send ligonierbill a Private Message  Reply with Quote
There may be a way, but I think you'll just crush the case. The 9.3x62 is not only 5 mm longer, the shoulder is further forward relative to the case body to maximize capacity. And you're reducing the diameter of the mouth; even if it doesn't buckle, you'd have to turn it. Just buy 8x57 cases, they're plentiful. Sell the 9.3, they're not. Why try to convert a relatively rare case to a very common one?
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manobras
New Member



10 Posts

Posted - Oct 17 2016 :  08:37:49  Show Profile Send manobras a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by ligonierbill

There may be a way, but I think you'll just crush the case. The 9.3x62 is not only 5 mm longer, the shoulder is further forward relative to the case body to maximize capacity. And you're reducing the diameter of the mouth; even if it doesn't buckle, you'd have to turn it. Just buy 8x57 cases, they're plentiful. Sell the 9.3, they're not. Why try to convert a relatively rare case to a very common one?



Hi,

Thanks for your answer.

30-06 cases are also longer and have the shoulder forward and they resize just fine, leaving a long neck to trim after being resized.

What do you mean by "And you're reducing the diameter of the mouth; even if it doesn't buckle, you'd have to turn it." I'm new to reloading and I don't know what is turning the mouth.

I'm from Portugal and, believe it or not, I can find a lot of 9.3x62 cases on the local range, but I never found a single 8 mm Mauser case.

Brass is very expensive in Europe, I'd like to avoid buying it new. And I also like the hacking involved in converting one caliber to another.

Regards,
MD



Kind regards,
MD
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Kosh75287
Advanced Member



USA
796 Posts

Posted - Oct 17 2016 :  08:56:10  Show Profile Send Kosh75287 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
+1 It is probably not impossible to form 8x57mm brass from 9.3x62 brass, but there are better calibers of brass to use, if they are available.

I've converted a fair number of .30-06 brass to 8x57mm and, with a reforming die (I recommend Redding's), it's a very simple matter. Because I'm converting a case from .308" TO .323", there's a slight thinning of the case neck, which is offset somewhat by the shoulder of the new round being set further back, into the thicker part of the brass. Basically it's a wash.

What you seek to do with the 9.3x62 goes in the opposite direction (necking DOWN the diameter, from .366" to .323"), and forming the shoulder of the 8x57mm round further back in the thicker part of the brass. If the (now) thicker brass at the neck is not removed, you'll have difficulties seating the smaller diameter projectile. If the smaller projectile CAN be seated, the thicker brass at the neck will "grip more tightly" the smaller projectile, which can make chamber pressures go dangerously high. Reducing the diameter of the newly formed neck by removing some it (ele diz "turning") is almost certainly a necessity, and it IS a chore.

I've also found that expanding the .308" diameter neck on the (to be reformed) .30-06 case to .312", THEN to .323" results in almost no splitting of the newly formed neck. The greatest problem(s) I have with neck splitting is when I try to reform and "neck-up" .25-06 brass. I usually run them over a .264" expander, then a .277" expander, then a .284" expander, before proceeding to expand the neck to .308", and on to .323". It work-hardens the brass a little, but far less than I expected.

If you have a plentiful supply of .30-06 brass, then using brass from other cartridges based on it won't be an issue. I have an M1 Garand that gets all the once-fired .30-06 brass I find. After being shot in the Garand 2 or 3 times, the brass usually gets reformed into 8x57mm. To feed both, the .30-06 goes in the "Garand bucket" and the .25-06 and .270 goes right to the 8x57mm bolt action.

Cartridges like .270 Winchester, .280 Remington, 8mm-06 are good for converting to 8x57mm. I think the 7x57mm Mauser case will also work, but may give you more split necks than you want.

God bless Jeff Cooper

Carpe SCOTCH!

Edited by - Kosh75287 on Oct 17 2016 09:05:53
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Shastaboat
Advanced Member



USA
9122 Posts

Posted - Oct 17 2016 :  10:18:56  Show Profile Send Shastaboat a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I see no reason why you can't form to 8x57. You may need to turn the necks after forming as well as trimming. I would anneal the neck and shoulder area first. No different than forming any other brass. Do it in steps and wipe off excess lube from the shoulder neck area to prevent dents.

If you don't understand any of the terminology of my post, just ask.

Edited by - Shastaboat on Oct 17 2016 19:50:34
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ligonierbill
Senior Member

USA
202 Posts

Posted - Oct 17 2016 :  14:10:12  Show Profile Send ligonierbill a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Now I understand. Sounds like a rich guy is shooting at your range. I surely would not leave 9.3x62 brass, but if that's what you have, give it a try. You will probably have to take a little off the diameter of the neck using a small lathe. But it sounds like you have some experience at this. Sometimes you just need to go for it. Good luck, and let us know how it works out.

Edited by - ligonierbill on Oct 17 2016 15:11:56
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F. Guffey
Advanced Member

USA
961 Posts

Posted - Oct 18 2016 :  10:02:31  Show Profile  Visit F. Guffey's Homepage Send F. Guffey a Private Message  Reply with Quote
There is a thread on this forum that almost covers everything a reloader needs to know about the small base die. I am the fan of measuring before and again after and then there is research’ I am the fan of research.

The 9.3mm62 case head measures .476” with a slight rebated rim meaning the rim is .473”. And then there is the length of the case from the end of the neck to the case head. The 9.3mm62 case length is 2.441”, I understand that does not seem like much but the 30/06 case length is 2.494 long. Meaning the 9.3mm62 is .053” shorter than the 30/06.

Now going from the 9.3mm62 to 8mm57; the 9.3mm62 is long enough but the case head diameter is .006” too large in diameter for the 8mm57 unless the reloader can find a way to reduce the diameter of the case head. And then there is a big problem when trying to size a solid case head in a full length sizing die and or a small base die.

I am not desperate for any case; forming 8mm57 from 9.3mm 62 for me would not be an option because of the case head diameter. I discourage working the case head, there is a possibility the case head could be turned down.

And then there is the possibility the 9.3mm62 cases has Berdan primers, but if the 9.3mm 62 cases have Boxer primers consider trading the cases. I do not need the 9.3mm62 cases but I will trade you 30/06 cases.

I form cases, I have forming dies for all of the cases I form.

F. Guffey


Edited by - F. Guffey on Oct 18 2016 10:05:46
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Shastaboat
Advanced Member



USA
9122 Posts

Posted - Oct 18 2016 :  11:17:17  Show Profile Send Shastaboat a Private Message  Reply with Quote
My reference shows that a 9.3x62 case has the same case head dimension as a 30-06 case. Since I have regularly formed 8x57 cases from 30-06, I am sure I could form 8x57 cases from 9.3x62 cases. Try it, you might like it. The only issue I can see as being a problem for you is if the parent cast is Berdan primed. Again, you may have to turn the necks if the finished formed case is too thick in that area. I think you will not have to do this as military 8x57 chamber necks are generally cut large to allow for ample expansion when fired. I would remove the expander rod from the 8x57 sizer die and back the die out about .150" for the first form and form in two steps. Between steps wipe the shoulder and neck area to remove excess lube to prevent dents. Good luck and let us know how you come out. Make sure you are using a strong compound cast steel press like an RCBS Rockchucker. No LEE aluminum presses. Good luck and let us know how you make out.
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F. Guffey
Advanced Member

USA
961 Posts

Posted - Oct 18 2016 :  11:37:50  Show Profile  Visit F. Guffey's Homepage Send F. Guffey a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
My reference shows that a 9.3x62 case has the same case head dimension as a 30-06 case.


I could like to take your word for it but I don't. The rim diameter is .470", there is a chance you got confused. I said the rim is slightly rebated, I exaggerated by .003".


http://stevespages.com/jpg/cd93x62.jpg

F. Guffey

Edited by - F. Guffey on Oct 18 2016 11:45:59
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F. Guffey
Advanced Member

USA
961 Posts

Posted - Oct 18 2016 :  11:43:09  Show Profile  Visit F. Guffey's Homepage Send F. Guffey a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Again, you may have to turn the necks if the finished formed case is too thick in that area.


Or he could measure before and again after because the 8mm57 chamber is a generous chamber, there is a possibility the thick case neck could tighten the neck a little.

F. Guffey
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ligonierbill
Senior Member

USA
202 Posts

Posted - Oct 18 2016 :  14:37:48  Show Profile Send ligonierbill a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Good catch on the case head diameter. If I was bound and determined to try this, I would cut about 2 cm off the bottom of a case and see whether or not it jams in my die. Berdan primed has also been mentioned; maybe that's why expensive cases were left at the range.
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F. Guffey
Advanced Member

USA
961 Posts

Posted - Oct 18 2016 :  15:19:57  Show Profile  Visit F. Guffey's Homepage Send F. Guffey a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
I would cut about 2 cm off the bottom of a case


2cm is = to .787016", that is just over 3/4" of an inch. I would strongly recommend you not do that. I would suggest you measure the case head thickness from the cup above the web to the case head. Most case head are from .200" to .250" thick.

F. Guffey
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EnglishTom
Advanced Member

United Kingdom
767 Posts

Posted - Oct 18 2016 :  16:09:46  Show Profile  Click to see EnglishTom's MSN Messenger address Send EnglishTom a Private Message  Reply with Quote
If the cases are Berdan primed they can be converted to boxer, common Berdan primers in European brass are the #126 primer 0.250"dia and the #86 primer 0.217"dia both can be converted

Edited by - EnglishTom on Oct 18 2016 16:10:42
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manobras
New Member



10 Posts

Posted - Oct 21 2016 :  06:45:48  Show Profile Send manobras a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hello Everybody,

Thank you all for sharing your knowledge.

He cases I have are all Boxer primed. I think I'll go for it and give it a try. I always make a dummy round, with no primer or powder to see if it chambers, before starting reloading for a new cartridge.

I've already anealed 4 cases and I hope I can try it this weekend.

My press is a Lyman Crusher II, so I think I'm good in this regard.

I'll post the results when done.

Regards,
MD


Kind regards,
MD
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Shastaboat
Advanced Member



USA
9122 Posts

Posted - Oct 21 2016 :  10:02:31  Show Profile Send Shastaboat a Private Message  Reply with Quote
You will be fine but again do the forming in 2 stages.
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F. Guffey
Advanced Member

USA
961 Posts

Posted - Oct 22 2016 :  13:02:02  Show Profile  Visit F. Guffey's Homepage Send F. Guffey a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I understand most of the information sounds like 'all you 'gotta' do is etc. If the forming process starts to create folds and creases contact me if you are interested in trading your cases for new 30/06 case.

I have a forming die for for almost ever thing I load for. If you are interested I will form the 30/06 cases to 8mm57. And if you know the length of the chamber from the shoulder to the bolt face I will form the cases to fit.

F. Guffey

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