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 Reduced Loads for .243 Winchester
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aerostarp
New Member

14 Posts

Posted - Jan 24 2008 :  12:51:54  Show Profile  Send aerostarp a Yahoo! Message Send aerostarp a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi All: I am new to the forum and rifle reloading (Have done all pistol calibers many years without incident.)I am making reduced loads for my 11 year old in .243 Winchester using the TP technique I read about here on this forum. I am using Sierra 100gr. spbt with 35.1gr. of IMR4350. I am using the technique described of taking 1 single-ply TP sheet, folding it up into a long cylinder and inserting it over the powder and pushing it flat against the powder with a wooden dowel. No sound of powder movement after the bullet is seated. I also have the exact same load made WITHOUT the TP. Any thoughts or re-assurances? Getting a little worried about all I read about SEE and Detonation. Anyone with a lot of experience loading like this? Sorry about duplicate posts - was not my intention - got lost. Great forum. Thanks, Wayne

CR
Advanced Member



USA
888 Posts

Posted - Jan 24 2008 :  20:27:46  Show Profile Send CR a Private Message  Reply with Quote
That would probably be a bad idea. IMR 4350 is a slow burning powder and most manuals caution against anything but near max loads with slow burning powders in .243. My Hornady manual list IMR 4350 specifically. I've never done the reduced loads so I can't say what powder would be safe but I've loaded 43 grains with 95gr bullets for my daughter since she was 10..CR
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homer j.
Senior Member

USA
270 Posts

Posted - Jan 24 2008 :  21:12:33  Show Profile Send homer j. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
aerostarp, look in the Lyman 48th. edition book, they list a powder charge of IMR 4350 at 35.5 for a 100gr. hornady bullet at 2579 FPS. at 48,500 PSI. But I have to agree with CR with reduced powder charges of slow burning powder. If it were me, and it's not. But I would pick another powder. IMR 4198, H 335, IMR 4227, SR 7625, SR 4759, somthing on that order.

homer j.
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aerostarp
New Member

14 Posts

Posted - Jan 25 2008 :  06:46:15  Show Profile  Send aerostarp a Yahoo! Message Send aerostarp a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Thanks to both of you for your input. I have decided to dismantle the IMR4350 reduced load cartridges and substitute IMR 4227 instead which I have available. Any suggested min/max loads since my 2 manuals do not show its use in the 100gr. .243 Win.? Load 7449 on this site recommends 25grs. @ 2450fps which looks good. Also, do you need to use a TP filler with this powder/load since it will occupy only a portion of the case volume? Thanks again for your help and concern - it is greatly appreciated. Wayne

Edited by - aerostarp on Jan 25 2008 06:55:31
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c-man
Advanced Member

607 Posts

Posted - Jan 25 2008 :  09:11:14  Show Profile Send c-man a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Aerostarp,

I have found that Speer gives the best info on reduced loading and Speer Manual 13 lists IMR-4198 between 18 and 20 grains for their 100 and 105 grain bullets (grand slam models). They don't for 100 grain "regular" spitzers.

There's one of those "weird" decisions you'll have to make. Does it matter that it's a spitzer and they call for only grand slams? Me, I would try it if I had 4198 with 100g spbt's but that's my opinion. These are truly reduced loads that'll give a velocity of 2000 fps or a little less. They are for plinking more than hunting, BUT,

IMHO, think you're wasting your time trying to reduce this .243. I would use a regular load like with 4064, 760, etc, and just load the bottom load. In other words, use a safer powder, on the low end.

11 will soon be 12 and 13...he or she won't even know what you're loading I bet, and before you know it, they'll have outgrown that .243 and you'll be looking at .270's.

"You do not have to balance the truth."
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ryalred
Average Member



USA
174 Posts

Posted - Jan 25 2008 :  10:06:01  Show Profile Send ryalred a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I too was interested in reduced loads for the .243 and the use of filler in light loads. I learned that filler can sometime be a problem with cases that have steep shoulders, like the .243. I also learned that detonation was only a problem when reloading slow powder light. Your powder is a relatively slow powder, but since it is listed in a respected reloading manual, your probably OK without filler. I was convinced to change to faster powders (pistol powders)--Blue Dot and IMR SR 4759 without any fillers. One of my best loads has been the 18 grains of Blue Dot with a 65 grain V-Max bullet. It is supper accurate and is somewhere in the 2700 fps. Recoil and report are significantly reduced and this still has plenty of energy. Any of the posts by Seafire have been especially helpful to me.

Red C
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MIKESBARRO
Advanced Member



USA
2789 Posts

Posted - Jan 25 2008 :  10:37:42  Show Profile Send MIKESBARRO a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Ryalred,

This is a post from Curly in another forum on this site. You may want to proceed with EXTREME caution:


Moderator





Canada
1500 Posts
Posted - Jan 24 2008 : 17:44:30
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Moderator's note: I'm glad to see our senior members stepped in here and steered the new member in a safer direction...Take a look in the Hornady Reloading Manuals #3 and #4....In the write up on the .243 Winchester it singles out IMR4350 as a real hazard for reduced loads....IT IS a great powder in that cartridge which I and members like CR have used for many years, but at loads within 10% of maximum....

Consider using IMR3031 and a charge of 32 grains with a 100 grain bullet....If there is too much space inside the case with that load for your liking, use a little kapok stuffing (see Speer Reloading Manual #9)..

I chronographed this load around 2,500 fps....safe in my rifle...

Curly
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aerostarp
New Member

14 Posts

Posted - Jan 25 2008 :  12:04:22  Show Profile  Send aerostarp a Yahoo! Message Send aerostarp a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I have definitely decided to dismantle the IMR4350 loads and want to thank all concerned. I have gone 35 years hangun reloading without incident and don't want to change that now.

I read IMR 4227 is their fastest powder - anyone have any experience with that in these loads? Anyone use hard cast bullets (95gr.) in these loads? Thanks Wayne
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steve4102
Advanced Member

USA
923 Posts

Posted - Jan 26 2008 :  09:47:57  Show Profile Send steve4102 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
How about a safe reduced 243 load straight from Hodgdon?

http://www.hodgdon.com/data/youth/243win_y.php


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hunterjoe21
Average Member



USA
198 Posts

Posted - Jan 26 2008 :  12:21:38  Show Profile Send hunterjoe21 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by c-man

Aerostarp,

I have found that Speer gives the best info on reduced loading and Speer Manual 13 lists IMR-4198 between 18 and 20 grains for their 100 and 105 grain bullets (grand slam models). They don't for 100 grain "regular" spitzers.

There's one of those "weird" decisions you'll have to make. Does it matter that it's a spitzer and they call for only grand slams? Me, I would try it if I had 4198 with 100g spbt's but that's my opinion. These are truly reduced loads that'll give a velocity of 2000 fps or a little less. They are for plinking more than hunting, BUT,

IMHO, think you're wasting your time trying to reduce this .243. I would use a regular load like with 4064, 760, etc, and just load the bottom load. In other words, use a safer powder, on the low end.

11 will soon be 12 and 13...he or she won't even know what you're loading I bet, and before you know it, they'll have outgrown that .243 and you'll be looking at .270's.



I guess I would have to agree, and ask "why bother?"

The 243 is already a light recoiling round, and if you were to tell the child they were shooting a reduced load, I'll bet they would never know the difference.

My 1911 is more effective than your 911.
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aerostarp
New Member

14 Posts

Posted - Jan 27 2008 :  09:13:04  Show Profile  Send aerostarp a Yahoo! Message Send aerostarp a Private Message  Reply with Quote
C-Man wrote:

"I have found that Speer gives the best info on reduced loading and Speer Manual 13 lists IMR-4198 between 18 and 20 grains for their 100 and 105 grain bullets (grand slam models). They don't for 100 grain "regular" spitzers.

IMHO, think you're wasting your time trying to reduce this .243. I would use a regular load like with 4064, 760, etc, and just load the bottom load. In other words, use a safer powder, on the low end."

I have done both- IMR4198 with 75gr. and 100gr. using TP as a filler since there is so little powder dispensed and used a 75 gr. bullet with IMR4350 at 43 grains (their near bottom load).

Thanks to all for your help, concern and advise. Wayne

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Paul B
Advanced Member

3210 Posts

Posted - Jan 27 2008 :  15:12:01  Show Profile Send Paul B a Private Message  Reply with Quote
"Your powder is a relatively slow powder, but since it is listed in a respected reloading manual, your probably OK without filler."

There is an article by a Mr. Roy Smith in either an early RIFLE or HANDLOADER Magazine. Mr. Smith was working up loads for a NEW rifle in .243. being a cautious type, he started with the lowest starting load he could find in any of his manuals using, you guessed it, IMR04350. He eventually had a KABOOM! At least the rifle didn't blow up completely. Naturally, he thought the load was too hot, so after repairing the rifle, he reduced the load a bit more. Another KABOOM!
After some thought, he went a bit higher than his first trial load and no problem. He was finally able to work up to a hunting load he could be happy with. it's too bad he didn't do more writing. The three, maybe four articles I've read were very entertaining and truly informative, although I disagreed mightly with him on one article. But that's another subject.
FWIW, I've read that the .243 Win. and 7MM Rem. Mag. are the two worst offenders when it comes to pressure problems with light loads , AKA PEP. My choice of powder for a light load in the .243 would be H-4895. IMR-4895 will work just as well. However, as some have said, the .243 doesn't kick all that bad, and I have to agree with that. Give the kids really good hearing protection as the muzzle blast can be quite sharp in some rifles. If the noise doesn't hurt their ears, odds are they'll never notice the recoil. I learned that one from shooting a .308 Win. with a 20" barrel and top loads of H-335. Take my word on that one, it's very loud. Big ball of fire out the muzzle too.
Paul B.
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