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manyplews
Average Member
109 Posts |
 Posted - Nov 03 2009 : 19:41:50
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I've used a Lee AutoPrime for about 40 years.In fact,I'm on the second one as the connecting rod on the 1st one is now too short from wear.
I've never had any problems but I've always used CCI or Winchester primers.I've also used a few Remington's with no problems.
Since primers have been scarce for the last 6 months,I had to buy some Federal's.
I see on Lee's website:
http://www.leeprecision.com/cgi/catalog/browse.cgi?1257294295.2161=/html/catalog/primtool.html#AutoPrime
warning
Users have reported that the primers in the tray of an Auto Prime can explode for various reasons, some of which include: a cocked primer, or an attempt to prime a case which has a primer already in place, or more than one primer on the punch, or priming a military case with the crimp not completely removed. Should an explosion occur, our tests have demonstrated that safety glasses will normally prevent serious injury to the user if CCI or Winchester primers are used, because the explosion is minimal. Other primers, however, can explode with sufficient force to seriously injure the user, or persons nearby. We do not take any position with respect to the quality or performance of primers available on the market. However, only those primers manufactured by CCI or Winchester are recommended for use in the Lee Auto Prime, and when loading those primers, safety glasses should always be used. No other primers should be used with the Lee Auto Prime.
Has anybody had any problems with Federal primers being used in the Autoprime?
Thanks!
BTW - don't bother to take these Federal's off my hands to dispose of them. |
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ten2six
Senior Member
USA
248 Posts |
Posted - Nov 04 2009 : 18:42:01
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Manyplews,
When I started reloading, Federal primers are what I used and I've stuck with them for the past 10 years. I started off with a Redding T-7 turret press, with a primer arm & tube. I did have some problems (no explosions, gratefully) getting them to seat sometimes. Because of the frustrations, I switched over to priming everything by hand now.
I've had the reverse situation to yours lately. I've had to use some CCI and Magtech primers, since that is all I could find. Compared to the Federals, the cups seem, what's the best term...stiffer. I now use a Sinclair hand primer, and the CCI's and Magtech's seem to need more force to start seating, and have more resistance when they bottom out. The Federal's seem to slide in easier, and do seem to be soft when fully seated (that is they feel like they are bending, or giving, a little).
Anyway, my reply doesn't help you any with your situation, but your feed made me think about what I've experienced. I'm interested to see what others can add. |
"Chances are, when we meet intelligent life forms in outer space, they're going to be descended from predators."
- Michio Kaku |
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robz
New Member
Australia
21 Posts |
Posted - Nov 05 2009 : 17:33:10
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I've never had any problems using Lee hand priming tool regardless of primer brand.
Just be sensible , wear safety glasses and point the thing away from you when you prime a case.
rob |
robz |
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homer j.
Senior Member
USA
258 Posts |
Posted - Nov 05 2009 : 20:16:22
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I have also used the Lee auto prime for 30+ years and never had problem with it, I have worn some part's out but that's all. And thats with all types of primers.
homer j. |
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Kansas Ed
Advanced Member
USA
701 Posts |
Posted - Nov 05 2009 : 20:48:41
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I have used Fed primers in the Lee hand primer for years. I've seen no issues so far. Lee has a habit of stirring the pot with various other component manufacturers, then "recommending" that those products aren't used with Lee products. Whether this has any bearing on the Federal recommendations I wouldn't say, but anytime Lee disses one brand of component or another I take it with a huge grain of salt because of their past history.
Ed |
Are we there yet??? |
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steve4102
Advanced Member
USA
811 Posts |
Posted - Nov 05 2009 : 20:54:27
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This is all about Richard Lee and ATK. Several years ago R Lee and Speer got into a pissing contest about Lee's factory crimp die. As a result Speer published in their manuals that using the LFCD with their bullets would degrade accuracy 40%. Of course this is complete and utter nonsense, but it is what it is.
This is from another site, but it explains it pretty well.
"a few years to when Speer and Richard Lee got into a ****ing match about the Lee Factory Crimp die. "
Yep. Actually, that was in the late 70s, early 80s if I remember correctly. Fred Hundington had sold RCBS, Vernon Speer sold and CCI sold out to the Blount Group so the original owners were gone and a bunch of distructive "professional" management MBAs were running things, wrongly. Pretty much damaged Blount in the same process.
Richard Lee had just gotten into making presses, dies, etc. His tools were designed from the gound up to be made on largely automated and CNC tooling by unskilled labor forces so they could be high grade tools sold at low prices. It worked. Soon, Lee was cutting deeply into the "big boys'" markets. Speer and RCBS struck back by publishing badly misleading magazine adds showing how badly Lee's tools worked, especially the (excellant) rifle Factory Crimp Dies. (They massively over-crimped some rifle bullets and put the photos in their adds to "prove" their point.)
Federal got caught up at the same time with a big suit claiming injury from some idiot misusing Federal primers, not a part of Blount, and it cost Lee a bundle to defend against Federal pointing a finger at Lee. Lee wanted no more of that so they started posting the warnings against the use of Federal caps we still see.
I don't believe Federal primers pose any more, or at least not much more, of a hazard than any other. I really haven't been able to see how Federal caps are "softer" than others, in fact my past experiments indicated they were a tad harder, but they do use a bit more sensitive priming compound. That sensitivity does make them more prone to chain firing if one does go off in a box, tube or tray. THAT'S why they are packed in individual holes in the packages. But they also have a LOW indidence of failure to fire and I like that!
I've run a lot of Federals though my Lee auto primer tools for over two decades with no problems. But, I don't use the Tim Taylor "More Power" method of dealing with anything that doesn't feel right either. If a primer won't go easily, I stop, find out why not and fix it before continuing . So far, so good.... |
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ten2six
Senior Member
USA
248 Posts |
Posted - Nov 05 2009 : 21:57:36
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Is a Lee "AutoPrime" the same thing as a hand primer? I'm not familiar if these are one and the same, or different, so can someone clarify this for me.
"Knowledge is a weapon...too bad I couldn't cut butter." |
"Chances are, when we meet intelligent life forms in outer space, they're going to be descended from predators."
- Michio Kaku |
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manyplews
Average Member
109 Posts |
Posted - Nov 05 2009 : 22:46:52
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quote:
Originally posted by steve4102
This is all about Richard Lee and ATK. Several years ago R Lee and Speer got into a pissing contest about Lee's factory crimp die. As a result Speer published in their manuals that using the LFCD with their bullets would degrade accuracy 40%. Of course this is complete and utter nonsense, but it is what it is.
This is from another site, but it explains it pretty well.
"a few years to when Speer and Richard Lee got into a ****ing match about the Lee Factory Crimp die. "
Yep. Actually, that was in the late 70s, early 80s if I remember correctly. Fred Hundington had sold RCBS, Vernon Speer sold and CCI sold out to the Blount Group so the original owners were gone and a bunch of distructive "professional" management MBAs were running things, wrongly. Pretty much damaged Blount in the same process.
Richard Lee had just gotten into making presses, dies, etc. His tools were designed from the gound up to be made on largely automated and CNC tooling by unskilled labor forces so they could be high grade tools sold at low prices. It worked. Soon, Lee was cutting deeply into the "big boys'" markets. Speer and RCBS struck back by publishing badly misleading magazine adds showing how badly Lee's tools worked, especially the (excellant) rifle Factory Crimp Dies. (They massively over-crimped some rifle bullets and put the photos in their adds to "prove" their point.)
Federal got caught up at the same time with a big suit claiming injury from some idiot misusing Federal primers, not a part of Blount, and it cost Lee a bundle to defend against Federal pointing a finger at Lee. Lee wanted no more of that so they started posting the warnings against the use of Federal caps we still see.
I don't believe Federal primers pose any more, or at least not much more, of a hazard than any other. I really haven't been able to see how Federal caps are "softer" than others, in fact my past experiments indicated they were a tad harder, but they do use a bit more sensitive priming compound. That sensitivity does make them more prone to chain firing if one does go off in a box, tube or tray. THAT'S why they are packed in individual holes in the packages. But they also have a LOW indidence of failure to fire and I like that!
I've run a lot of Federals though my Lee auto primer tools for over two decades with no problems. But, I don't use the Tim Taylor "More Power" method of dealing with anything that doesn't feel right either. If a primer won't go easily, I stop, find out why not and fix it before continuing . So far, so good....
Thanks,steve;
That sounds reasonable.
I know you have to stay awake as the "feed" on these tools isn't perfect.
I've seated an occasional one sideways and upside down but more frequently,I've gotten two on the punch. |
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slabsides45
New Member
USA
32 Posts |
Posted - Nov 13 2009 : 11:46:50
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| I was considering posting a thread asking this same question, as I thought it bizarre that Federal was singled out. In reloading for .45 ACP, I've found that Federals are more reliable for me, and I buy them preferentially. Thanks for the thread and the info! |
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Winchester 69
Average Member
USA
171 Posts |
Posted - Nov 13 2009 : 16:09:29
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Lee also has a warning regarding not using certain Winchester primers.
I use an AutoPrime II, the press-mounted version. I have developed a two-step process. My first step is to lower the press's ram far enough to feed a primer onto the punch. I watch the primers progress into the loading body and can see that only one primer advances. Then I raise the press ram far enough to assure that that the primer is laying flat on the punch. The second part of the process is to place a case into the shell holder and prime, lowering the ram, but not fully, so that the primed case may be removed from the press.
I feel absolutely confident in what I'm doing and have no concerns regarding a mishap. The primer is well-removed from the reservoir such that if the primer being loaded were to pop, it would not be with other primers being adjacent to the detonation as there is with hand-held tools or those using tubular feeds.
I really don't see where the brand of primer is a consideration. All pistol primers are softer than rifle primers, and, in the case of Winchester brand, that criterion doesn't enter into the discrimination. Logically, if the strength of construction were the primary factor, ALL pistol primers would be excluded. |
"I know things about pigeons, Lily." - Eastwood |
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Lee Auto-Prime/Federal Primers ??
