Reloader's Nest Forum
Reloader's Nest Forum
Home | Profile | Active Topics | Members | Private Messages | Search | FAQ
Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

 All Forums
 Reloading General
 Techniques
 Less headspace on a once fired round..How?
 New Topic  Reply to Topic
 Printer Friendly
Previous Page
Author Previous Topic Topic Next Topic
Page: of 3

F. Guffey
Advanced Member

USA
961 Posts

Posted - Nov 07 2016 :  08:02:25  Show Profile  Visit F. Guffey's Homepage Send F. Guffey a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Deprime the fired brass before taking the Headspace measurement.


Allow me the luxury of disagreeing; A reloader needs to know if the primer is protruding from the case head after firing. If the primer is protruding the case did not form. This problem is what this thread is about; the case is shorter after firing. Then we need to understand ‘the mystery of the shortening case’. The case can get shorter when fired from the end of the neck to the case head, this is the situation reloaders talk about when there case gets shorter. And then there is the other shorter, which is the one when the case gets shorter from the shoulder to the case head. Cases that get shorter from the shoulder to the case head are caused by bad habits practiced by the reloader. I believe reduced loads are cute, I do not shoot reduced loads; but if I did the step sequence of events that take place when the trigger is pulled are out the window.

quote:
Deprime the fired brass before taking the Headspace measurement.


My cases do not have head space, I use the length of the case from the shoulder to the case head to off set the length of the chamber. The difference in length between my chamber and the case when measured from the shoulder to the case head is clearance.

F. Guffey

Go to Top of Page

Ireload2
Senior Member

USA
286 Posts

Posted - Nov 12 2016 :  12:15:42  Show Profile Send Ireload2 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
If you have a plunger ejector, like most push feed designs, you do not have clearance at the shoulder. You have clearance at the case head.

quote:
Originally posted by F. Guffey

[quote]
My cases do not have head space, I use the length of the case from the shoulder to the case head to off set the length of the chamber. The difference in length between my chamber and the case when measured from the shoulder to the case head is clearance.

F. Guffey



Go to Top of Page

F. Guffey
Advanced Member

USA
961 Posts

Posted - Nov 14 2016 :  06:43:13  Show Profile  Visit F. Guffey's Homepage Send F. Guffey a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
If you have a plunger ejector, like most push feed designs, you do not have clearance at the shoulder. You have clearance at the case head.


As I have said before, there is something about the sequence of events that happens after the trigger is pulled most reloaders do not understand. SO!? IF there is any truth to what you have stated what happens when the extractor jumps the rim of the case?

Or, when does the extractor jump the rim?

And then there is that question I ask do often about case travel; I am the fan of cutting down on all that case travel.

F. Guffey
Go to Top of Page

F. Guffey
Advanced Member

USA
961 Posts

Posted - Nov 14 2016 :  06:47:13  Show Profile  Visit F. Guffey's Homepage Send F. Guffey a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Ireload2, Do you have any ideal how dumb it is to start with the shoulder of the case against the shoulder of the chamber and clearance between the bolt face and case head?

F. Guffey

Edited by - F. Guffey on Nov 14 2016 06:48:12
Go to Top of Page

Shastaboat
Advanced Member



USA
9125 Posts

Posted - Nov 14 2016 :  10:57:29  Show Profile Send Shastaboat a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by F. Guffey

Ireload2, Do you have any ideal how dumb it is to start with the shoulder of the case against the shoulder of the chamber and clearance between the bolt face and case head?

F. Guffey



Guffey, as usual you are an idiot!
Go to Top of Page

F. Guffey
Advanced Member

USA
961 Posts

Posted - Nov 14 2016 :  12:23:48  Show Profile  Visit F. Guffey's Homepage Send F. Guffey a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Guffey, as usual you are an idiot!


Shastaboat, Just an opinion but I believe you should stay out of the fast lane.

But now that you are out there explain the difference between having clearance between the shoulder of the chamber and shoulder of the case as opposed t clearance between the case head and bolt face.

It is not my intention to jam you up but try to remember there is a case with a belt, there is a case with a rim and there are bottle neck cases.

F. Guffey
Go to Top of Page

Ireload2
Senior Member

USA
286 Posts

Posted - Nov 30 2016 :  07:09:42  Show Profile Send Ireload2 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hey Guffey
What is your point?
Why don't YOU TELL US how dumb it is.
Tell your tale of woe to all of the designers of plunger ejector rifles starting with John C Garand. Those guys know more about design than you ever will.
The list will include the 700, 788, 760 and 740 Rem family, 40X Rem, the push feed M70 Win, Win models 88 and 100, the push feed M77 Rugers, Browning BLR, Savage 110 family and many others. All these rifles and others do that with factory ammo. Even some models of the 340 Savage have it. Don't forget the AR15 and M-16 family while you are at it. There are even a few like the Win 100 that has 2 plunger ejectors.



quote:
Originally posted by F. Guffey

Ireload2, Do you have any ideal how dumb it is to start with the shoulder of the case against the shoulder of the chamber and clearance between the bolt face and case head?

F. Guffey


Edited by - Ireload2 on Nov 30 2016 07:53:07
Go to Top of Page

F. Guffey
Advanced Member

USA
961 Posts

Posted - Jan 13 2017 :  16:39:05  Show Profile  Visit F. Guffey's Homepage Send F. Guffey a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
If you have a plunger ejector, like most push feed designs, you do not have clearance at the shoulder. You have clearance at the case head.


Ireload2, I have been accused of building booby traps for people like you, I have never denied it but I have never seen the need to build a trap because a booby is too each to catch. Now that you are in the fast lane and showing off explained how that could happen and became you are the expert explain to this forum what would happen if the case was not against the bolt face when fired.

Again, I say there has to be something about the sequence of events that happen between the trigger being pulled and the bullet leaves the barrel.

Do not forget the details and the sequence of events. I would not ask Woods for help and or advise.

F. Guffey

Edited by - F. Guffey on Jan 13 2017 16:40:34
Go to Top of Page

F. Guffey
Advanced Member

USA
961 Posts

Posted - Jan 13 2017 :  16:47:01  Show Profile  Visit F. Guffey's Homepage Send F. Guffey a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Less headspace on a once fired round. How?


So I do not confuse you the case does not have head space, least we forget I have had members on reloading forums call SAAMI and report me. After they talked to SAAMI nothing changed, the case still does not have head space. A case gage from the beginning has always been a case gage, it was never a head space gage.

From the beginning? That would put it at 1954 +/- a year or two, and then came the Internet.

F. Guffey
Go to Top of Page

F. Guffey
Advanced Member

USA
961 Posts

Posted - Jan 13 2017 :  17:20:29  Show Profile  Visit F. Guffey's Homepage Send F. Guffey a Private Message  Reply with Quote
And while you are showing off and in the fast lane explain how it is possible to bump the shoulder back, reloaders are infatuated with moving the shoulder. I have insisted for years moving the shoulder back is almost impossible to do.

An acceptable answer would be "I do not know" another good answer would be "I have never thought of it and have always assumed the shoulder moved". And then there is your usual response that is socially dysfunctional.

F. Guffey
Go to Top of Page

Shastaboat
Advanced Member



USA
9125 Posts

Posted - Jan 13 2017 :  23:14:21  Show Profile Send Shastaboat a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Smells like my dog just cut another one in here.
Go to Top of Page

Ireload2
Senior Member

USA
286 Posts

Posted - Jan 14 2017 :  00:52:42  Show Profile Send Ireload2 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Guffey
You make absolutely no sense.
Why don't you talk about plunger ejectors.
You seem to know NOTHING about firearms design.
When the plunger pushes the case forward the case is stopped by the chamber shoulder and the clearance is at the bolt face.
If the case is too short to stop at the shouldeer then the case hangs up on the extractor or the belt or the rim. The result- the clearance is still at the bolt face.
No matter what you claim about sequence of events you are wrong when it comes to clearance in the chamber.
You trapped yourself. You should not drag Woods into this.



quote:
Originally posted by F. Guffey

quote:
If you have a plunger ejector, like most push feed designs, you do not have clearance at the shoulder. You have clearance at the case head.


Ireload2, I have been accused of building booby traps for people like you, I have never denied it but I have never seen the need to build a trap because a booby is too each to catch. Now that you are in the fast lane and showing off explained how that could happen and became you are the expert explain to this forum what would happen if the case was not against the bolt face when fired.

Again, I say there has to be something about the sequence of events that happen between the trigger being pulled and the bullet leaves the barrel.

Do not forget the details and the sequence of events. I would not ask Woods for help and or advise.

F. Guffey



Edited by - Ireload2 on Jan 14 2017 01:21:30
Go to Top of Page

Ireload2
Senior Member

USA
286 Posts

Posted - Jan 14 2017 :  01:06:18  Show Profile Send Ireload2 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
The following quote by you says nothing choherent whatsoever.
It appears to be the work of someone that scores 36 on the Asperger's test.
It is standard Guffey obfuscation and confabulation. You can not distinguish reality from imagination. Your logic is so poor that you cannot form coherent thoughts and your English is so poor you cannot communicate on the level of a 10 year old. You are the only one here confused. You are always confused and you are always attempting to BS your way through some goofy story with no coherent train of thought.

No one said the case has headspace did they?
No one referenced SAAMI.
No one called a case gage a headpace gage though there are ways to make it work as one. If you can't make it work or you choke on the semantics it is your problem not ours.

In the beginning is what? Your birthdate?
Plunger ejectors existed long before you began reloading.
They will exist long after you quit reloading.
There will still be clearance at the bolt face with factory ammo.
Admit it....you are wrong.


quote:
Originally posted by F. Guffey

quote:
Less headspace on a once fired round. How?


So I do not confuse you the case does not have head space, least we forget I have had members on reloading forums call SAAMI and report me. After they talked to SAAMI nothing changed, the case still does not have head space. A case gage from the beginning has always been a case gage, it was never a head space gage.

From the beginning? That would put it at 1954 +/- a year or two, and then came the Internet.

F. Guffey

Go to Top of Page

Ireload2
Senior Member

USA
286 Posts

Posted - Jan 14 2017 :  01:15:11  Show Profile Send Ireload2 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
What is it called if I put the case in an optical comparator and the datum ring is closer to the head after it was sized than it was before it was sized?

Moving the shoulder is easy to do. So easy that even a cave man can do it. So easy that every one can do it except you Guffey.
You can't seem to do much of anything except diddle with semantics and obfuscation.

Countless people have been modifying cases since the late 1860s.
Everyone but you...

Why is it that you cannot move shoulders while everyone else can?
Do you admit to suffering from arrested development?
It is no big deal to form a 5.56 case to .221.
So if I form a .221 case what do you call the process that changes the length from the case head to the .330 datum circle?
Can you answer this or are you going to spin more baloney?


quote:
Originally posted by F. Guffey

And while you are showing off and in the fast lane explain how it is possible to bump the shoulder back, reloaders are infatuated with moving the shoulder. I have insisted for years moving the shoulder back is almost impossible to do.

An acceptable answer would be "I do not know" another good answer would be "I have never thought of it and have always assumed the shoulder moved". And then there is your usual response that is socially dysfunctional.

F. Guffey


Edited by - Ireload2 on Jan 14 2017 01:16:58
Go to Top of Page
Page: of 3 Previous Topic Topic Next Topic  
Previous Page
 New Topic  Reply to Topic
 Printer Friendly
Jump To:
Reloader's Nest Forum © 2016 ReloadersNest Go To Top Of Page
This page was generated in 0.23 seconds. Powered By: Snitz Forums 2000 Version 3.4.06